Friday, October 03, 2008



Job well done!

Anonymous -- I fondly thought of you when I spotted the below button on the internet. I dedicate to you!


MightyMom said...

I'm at work...unable to watch or follow.....

so I guess it went well in your opinion huh??

William said...

CBS Poll: More Uncommitted Voters Saw Biden As Winner: 46%-21%

CNN poll gives the debate to Biden: 51% to 36%

Conservative columnist Kathleen Parker's ode to Palin and 'Joe six-pack' in the WaPost: Palin was like "witnessing a data dump from a very appealing droid".

Palin refused to answer moderator's question, spouts rehearsed attack lines, and offers nothing to distinguish herself and McSame from the colossal failures of the Bush administration.

The saving grace here is that she did just well enough to remain on the ticket to further cripple McBush's chances. Frankly I was fearful of another desperat McStunt, like him pulling Palin off the ticket and replacing her with someone qualified.

~~Deby said...

She was the winner....last night FOX said 86% for her....from over 1 million calling in...NOT the liberal news pundits from the far left news stations, that are Obama's chherleaders instead of staying fair and balanced.
She done good..I commented below on your other controversial post(hehehe) go girl.
"say it ain't so Joe, doggone it"

Anonymous said...

I was amazed at how the liberal news people praised her last night. Wow, they were actually nice.

She did great and we were proud!

Anonymous said...

William: GO AWAY.

(La sobrina de Pam)

William said...

Who won the VP debate?
712,445 votes

Joe Biden - 51%
Sarah Palin - 39%
Tie 4.4%

This squares with all the other real polls… I know, I know … things are different in your exclusive reality of Fox News/Drudge.

In the narrow “Fox News/Drudge reality,” everyone in the mainstream is evil, leftist, and wrong. Most of these people belong to an older, dying generation. They are found mostly in the south, in rural areas where ignorance and racism flourish, also in the nearly all-white retirement communities in FL.

game over

Pam said...

William, you make me smile!

I'm well aware of those polls you cited. I peek in to CBS and CNN and even wacko MSNBC randomly just to get a chuckle. Thanks for your concern in seeing that I'm well informed. Just know this -- I read and think. I know what I think are important policies and issues for my sons and grandkid's futures. Obama isn't it!

Did you catch the inaccurracies(downright lies) Biden spouted concerning Senator McCain's voting record? Of course not!

Jungle Mom said...

William, Vete , pues!

Maybe you should spend your time to teach Biden a few things which those of us here already know.Biden had At least 14 outright lies! And does not even know the difference between Gaza and the West Bank!
It must have been so painful for the loyalist left to see the new girl eat up their 'experienced' candidate! Imagine how she would have chewed up Obama if they debated!!!

Jungle Mom said...

Joe Biden’s outright lies during the debate:

1. TAX VOTE: Biden said McCain voted “the exact same way” as Obama to increase taxes on Americans earning just $42,000, but McCain DID NOT VOTE THAT WAY.

2. AHMEDINIJAD MEETING: Joe Biden lied when he said that Barack Obama never said that he would sit down unconditionally with Mahmoud Ahmedinijad of Iran. Barack Obama did say specifically, and Joe Biden attacked him for it.

3. OFFSHORE OIL DRILLING: Biden said, “Drill we must.” But Biden has opposed offshore drilling and even compared offshore drilling to “raping” the Outer Continental Shelf.”

4. TROOP FUNDING: Joe Biden lied when he indicated that John McCain and Barack Obama voted the same way against funding the troops in the field. John McCain opposed a bill that included a timeline, that the President of the United States had already said he would veto regardless of it’s passage.

5. OPPOSING CLEAN COAL: Biden says he’s always been for clean coal, but he just told a voter that he is against clean coal and any new coal plants in America and has a record of voting against clean coal and coal in the U.S. Senate.

6. ALERNATIVE ENERGY VOTES: According to, Biden is exaggerating and overstating John McCain’s record voting for alternative energy when he says he voted against it 23 times.

7. HEALTH INSURANCE: Biden falsely said McCain will raise taxes on people’s health insurance coverage — they get a tax credit to offset any tax hike. Independent fact checkers have confirmed this attack is false

8. OIL TAXES: Biden falsely said Palin supported a windfall profits tax in Alaska — she reformed the state tax and revenue system, it’s not a windfall profits tax.

9. AFGHANISTAN / GEN. MCKIERNAN COMMENTS: Biden said that top military commander in Iraq said the principles of the surge could not be applied to Afghanistan, but the commander of NATO’s International Security Assistance Force Gen. David D. McKiernan said that there were principles of the surge strategy, including working with tribes, that could be applied in Afghanistan.

10. REGULATION: Biden falsely said McCain weakened regulation — he actually called for more regulation on Fannie and Freddie.

11. IRAQ: When Joe Biden lied when he said that John McCain was “dead wrong on Iraq”, because Joe Biden shared the same vote to authorize the war and differed on the surge strategy where they John McCain has been proven right.

12. TAX INCREASES: Biden said Americans earning less than $250,000 wouldn’t see higher taxes, but the Obama-Biden tax plan would raise taxes on individuals making $200,000 or more.

13. BAILOUT: Biden said the economic rescue legislation matches the four principles that Obama laid out, but in reality it doesn’t meet two of the four principles that Obama outlined on Sept. 19, which were that it include an emergency economic stimulus package, and that it be part of “part of a globally coordinated effort with our partners in the G-20.”

14. REAGAN TAX RATES: Biden is wrong in saying that under Obama, Americans won’t pay any more in taxes then they did under Reagan

William said...

Hi Jungle Mom, Thankyou for parroting the wingnut talking points. For a Christian Dominionist like yourself, Palin must be a dream candidate!

Unfortunately she said more than 50 things that were contradictory, misleading or out right lies...

Palin said we’re now at pre-surge troop levels in Iraq. This is wrong. There were 130,000 troops in Iraq before the surge. Today, there are 147,000 troops in Iraq. (UPDATE: McCain made this same error in June.)

Despite repeatedly criticizing Biden for looking backward tonight, Palin closed the night with a quote from President Reagan.

Palin bragged that as governor, she has appointed people “regardless of political affiliation.” However, high school affiliation has been very important. As the New York Times noted, “The Wasilla High School yearbook archive now doubles as a veritable directory of state government.” Palin has appointed her former junior high band-mate, among others.

Palin said McCain will boost jobs with policies that “build up infrastructure and reign in government spending.” In fact, to build infrastructure you need to spend money. McCain has proposed an across-the-board spending freeze that would result in real cuts in infrastructure construction and maintenance.

Palin just praised Alaska politicians ability to “work together,” yet Palin refuses to cooperate with the Alaska legislature’s investigation into her alleged ethics violation known as “Troopergate.”

Palin said that she can’t think of anything on which she changed her position. And if you believe that, there’s a Bridge to Nowhere we’d like to sell you.

Asked to describe her weaknesses, Palin seems to be answering a completely different question that only she heard. She delivered a rambling answer describing her strengths and what she would bring to the ticket. Ifill asked no follow-up question.

Joe Biden calls Dick Cheney “one of the most dangerous vice presidents” in history.

Palin just spoke quite eloquently about her understanding of what it’s like to worry about lacking health insurance. Unfortunately, the Palin/McCain health care plan would do nothing to cover the uninsured. She has previously credited “good union jobs” for giving them health care.

Palin said the constitution allowed for flexibility in the office of the Vice President. Previously, aides to Palin refused to answer whether she would be part of the executive branch.

Palin claimed that Alaska’s “energy” supply (by which she means only oil) is helping America on the path to energy independence. This is nonsense.

Palin said she was grateful the Constitution granted the authority to the Vice President to preside over the Senate “should they choose to exert it.” Of course, presiding over the Senate is not a choice, it’s a mandated duty of the Constitution. And the VP only casts votes in the event of a tie.

Palin repeatedly referring to Gen. McKiernan as “McClellan”

Palin said education “needs to be ramped up in terms of funding.” But last Friday, McCain’s proposed a spending freeze in all discretionary federal spending would would allow inflation to cut funding for Head Start by over $968 million, cut $1.7 billion from community learning centers, and cut $3.7 billion from career and technical education grants. More on McCain’s education record and plans here.

Palin’s recent confusion over McCain’s position on education spending isn’t the first time a McCain surrogate has gotten confused and called for more funding even while McCain himself wants to reduce expenditures.

The Washington Post’s Fact Checker says that Palin’s claim that Biden backed McCain’s military policies until this presidential race “is flatly false.” “Biden was an outspoken opponent of President Bush’s troop increases in Iraq as soon as Bush announced them after the 2006 elections. As Foreign Relations Committee Chairman, he led the most heated hearings before the troops were actually deployed.”

Palin is referring to her notes with increasing frequency as the debate focuses on foreign policy.

Palin said we need the “surge principles” in Iraq to be used in Afghanistan. Biden makes the point that Gen. McKiernan, the commanding general in Afghanistan, said: “The word I don’t use for Afghanistan is ’surge.’”

Palin accused Biden of “looking backwards” in critiquing the Bush administration. But of course, McCain’s future policies mirror Bush’s. McCain himself declared, “I have agreed with President Bush far more than I have disagreed. And on the transcendent issues, the most important issues of our day, I’ve been totally in agreement and support of President Bush.”

Palin said that promoting peace between Israel and Palestine would be “a top of an agenda item” in a McCain administration. But McCain’s neoconservative foreign policy advisers have said McCain intends to put the issue on a back-burner and won’t press for a peace agreement. “Not once during this campaign season have we been able to find John McCain committing to supporting, let alone promoting, a two-state solution.”

Like McCain, Palin keeps referring to Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as the “leader of Iran.” However, as Biden noted, the Ayatollah Khameini is the leader of Iran who sets policy.

Palin says Iran “cannot be allowed to acquire nuclear weapons” but is apparently unwilling to make an effort at direct, high-level diplomacy aimed at preventing them from doing so.

Palin spoke about the importance of the war in Iraq. In March 2007, Palin admitted, “I’ve been so focused on state government, I haven’t really focused much on the war in Iraq.”

Palin is making repeated references to “victory” and “winning” in Iraq while also praising General Petraeus even though he’s specifically disavowed those two terms.

Palin says that Obama voted against funding for the troops, but says “that’s hardly the whole story.” In April 2007, Democrats added a “non-binding call to withdraw” to a troop funding measure. “McCain (who was absent for the vote) urged the president to veto that funding measure, because of the withdrawal language. President Bush did veto it, and McCain applauded Bush’s veto. Based on those facts, it would be literally true to say that ‘McCain urged a veto of funding for our troops.’”

Palin said that the plan that Obama, Maliki, and President Bush currently supports is “a white flag of surrender.”

Palin spoke out against “early withdrawal” from Iraq, but the Iraqi government itself has already endorsed the withdrawal of American combat forces along the schedule Obama has proposed.

Answering a question about gay rights, Palin said she was tolerant of adults “choosing relationships for themselves.” But all major mainstream medical and mental health professional organizations have concluded that homosexuality is not a choice.

Although Alaska does grant spousal benefits to same-sex partners of public employees, Palin backed a state constitutional ban to deny these benefits.

Palin mentioned “clean, green natural gas.” Natural gas, like all other fossil fuels, comes with a huge health and environmental footprint, from drilling to burning. The natural gas industry is responsible for 18.6% of greenhouse gas emissions in the United States.

Palin said that global warming is, in part, caused by human activity. But in a recently released interview with Newsmax, Palin said, “I’m not one though who would attribute it to being man-made.” In Dec. 2007, she reportedly said, “I’m not an Al Gore, doom-and-gloom environmentalist blaming the changes in our climate on human activity.”

Palin’s answer on global warming tonight was only slightly more coherent than her last shot at it:

Palin says, “I don’t want to argue about the causes” of global warming. She admits that the Subcabinet on Climate Change she formed is just meant to deal with adaptation – not reducing the cause of global warming: fossil fuel emissions. McCain said at the Clinton Global Initiative on September 25: “We now know that fossil fuel emissions, by retaining heat within the atmosphere, threaten disastrous changes in climate.”

Palin said that the McCain-Palin ticket supports alternative energy, but she only mentioned nuclear and clean coal. McCain says he is against subsidies for real renewable sources of energy like wind power and solar power.

Discussing carbon emissions, Palin referred to unnamed “countries” that are polluting “more than the US.” In fact, only one country, China, has a higher level of carbon emissions than the United States and the US has by far the highest per capita carbon emissions of any major country.

The notion that John McCain’s proposed reforms to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac could have prevented the current crisis is a myth. Among other things, “Fannie and Freddie did not guarantee and securitize subprime loans.”

Palin is touting herself as an energy expert, but she recently claimed that Alaska produces “nearly 20 percent of the U.S. domestic supply of energy.” In reality, “Alaska’s share of domestic energy production was 3.5 percent.”

Palin accused Obama of giving tax breaks to oil companies. In reality, McCain’s tax plan would provide oil companies with $4 billion in tax breaks.

Palin’s deeply confusing disquisition on taking on oil companies in Alaska was a reference to her implementation of what amounted to an windfall profits tax on oil companies — the kind of tax that Obama has proposed and McCain opposed.

Despite Palin’s claim, McCain is constantly telling one thing to one group and another thing to another group. Here’s a list of 44 flip flops.

Palin said McCain’s health care plan would eliminate “artificial boundaries between states” and allow insurance companies to sell policies across state lines. Unfortunately, this would permit insurance companies to ignore in-state consumer protections and would provide Americans with less-comprehensive policies.

Palin says, “I had to take on those oil companies.” On behalf of Big Oil, Palin has fought the Department of Interior to claim polar bears in prime drilling territory are not under threat from global warming — using junk science bought and paid for by Exxon Mobil.

Palin touted McCain’s plan to give families a $5,000 tax credit to pay for health care. Since health care typically costs $12,000, Elizabeth Edwards said McCain’s plan “shows that he is completely out of touch with what is happening in the health care system in America today.”

Palin called McCain’s health credits “a smart thing to do.” In reality, McCain’s health care plan would undermine employer-based coverage and increase out-of-pocket expenses.

Palin said that she and her husband have been in the middle class their whole lives, but the AP reported yesterday that if you “add up the couple’s 2007 income and the estimated value of their property and investments and they appear to be worth at least $1.2 million.” (Later in the debate, Palin refers to herself as a “Main Streeter.”)

This discussion of the two presidential campaigns’ tax plans would benefit from reference to the Tax Policy Center’s definitive study of the impact, showing that most people would pay lower taxes under the Obama plan while a wealthy minority would pay dramatically lower taxes under McCain.

While Palin claimed that McCain supports strong regulation of the tobacco industry, McCain adviser Douglas Holtz-Eakin explained recently that McCain no longer supports “raising taxes on cigarettes”
even though such taxes are proven to deter youth smoking.

Palin’s discussion of her budget policies as mayor of Wasilia conveniently forgot to mention that her tax cuts and spending plans resulted in a massive increase in the town’s debt load. The tax amounted to $3,000 per resident.

Palin claimed that Barack Obama had voted to increase taxes 94 times. called this “count is padded.” “A closer look reveals that he’s voted consistently to restore higher tax rates on upper-income taxpayers but not on middle- or low-income workers,” wrote Factcheck.

Palin says, “Darn right we we need tax relief.” McCain’s health care plan would increase taxes on middle class Americans.

Palin rightly slammed the role of predatory lenders in contributing to the root causes of the current financial crisis, but failed to note her running mate’s years of opposition to legislative efforts to curb predatory lending practices.

Palin accuses Obama of voting along party lines, ignoring the fact that McCain has voted 100 percent of the time with Bush in 2008.

Palin’s claim that two years ago, McCain was warning about an economic crisis is an exaggeration. In an interview in November 2007, McCain admitted that he was clueless about the economic mess: “So, I’d like to tell you that I did anticipate it, but I have to give you straight talk, I did not.”

Perhaps in an attempt to make up for the fact that John McCain neglected to wear a flag pin to last Friday’s presidential debate, Sarah Palin is wearing a flag pin about the size of a child’s fist.

Palin wants John McCain to get credit for having “suspended” his campaign to work on the economic crisis, but as is now well known there was no suspension. Campaign spokespeople continued to attack Obama on cable, ads kept running, and campaign offices stayed open.

Jungle Mom said...

Since you copy and paste so well, I thought I could as well.;)
The fact is people like you only confirm our decision to back McCain. I am not so much afraid of Obama as I am his supporters. The blind worship is borderline psychotic!

William said...

I think most of the neocon mentality is a dying breed... mostly exhibited by the old white generation and Christianist Dominionists. It's dying breed really. You may remember a time where the religious right didn't align itself with a political party the way they now do. Fortunately, for the unity and integrity of American democracy, the present Republican Administration has proved a complete failure. As will the attempt to exert control over our nation by people who are guided by "the invisible man in the sky". In short, space age weaponry controlled by Dark Ages mentality where only one perspective is correct and all others are deemed evil. Not the America I love.

William said...

heh... and you call ME borderline psychotic?

Jungle Mom said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
William said...

Sorry, it must be due to my education and the people I work with. Myself and 95% of us are PhDs and we are from all parts of the world.

Jungle Mom said...

I apologize. My last comment was over the top and unnecessary.
However, why would I care if you work with people from all over the world or if you happen to have an obviously liberal influenced education?

Webutante said...

It did go so well last night! Thanks for your comment, Pam.

Pam said...

For the record, here are the folks who make up my "circle" of friends:
Whites, young and old, Hispanics, a Jewish trial lawyer, a single mom, a high school drop out, several small business owners, most of my aunts, cousins, uncles are teachers and/or coaches in the public school system, One aunt is a registered nurse, Pastors, Professors at USF, little children who need lots of encouragement, my family! Some are not as conservative as I am, some are outright liberal, but we're friends and understand we each have the freedom to practice our beliefs. None are name callers to my knowledge! Well, I take exception for my sister here! LOL

William said...

We're all Americans and that is most important. Hopefully we can leave power struggles and blame aside and move forward together to a better future.

Jungle Mom said...

I am sorry! My bad!
We just returned from an election debate held here in AsunciĆ³n for the ex pat community. Guess what? democrats can lie in Spansih too!